Crushes, BF and GF, and more!

[Eugene Blackgaard]

What dideth you thinketh?

[gimp80995]

AM...
That post was really uncalled for... IMO... I'm not saying that you're bad... just that your anger is misplaced.

And I, like EB will not try to consol you or calm you down either... Quite frankly, you need to grow up some and get over it. He's NOT trying to FORCE somethign down your throat. He's giving you good, sound advice. Filling in gaps.
I really don't see why/ how you could get mad at someone when they tell you to... " seek Godly, wise adult counsel, prefereably people who know you, are older than you, and, if possible, your parents. "
That is awesome advice.
"So says the fool before his folly." yeah.. that probably stung, but he's right. WE do NOT know how to "run" our lives... As Christains WE are not SUPPOSED to run our lives.. Christ is..

If you wish to ignore my post, please cease misusing Melissa I as an example.

I am PROUD of him for standing up and saying that. I would do the same. I would not appreciate people making light of my situation either...

Justin... I do not remember if I said anything about you an Melissa in any way, but I appreciate the both of you and what you stand for. Thank you. Thanks to the both of you for keeping it that way. You are both awesome friends, and great examples. I'm sorry if I said anything derogatory towards either of you about your relationship...

And once again my little sister and I share veiws here......I was going to post a similar post yesterday, but I ran out of time at the library, and I was to worked up to make a post without turning this thread into a fight (which was accomplished without my help).

Justin (Hawkeye) got irritated with us playing around and using his relationship as an example and making light of the situation. I think his irritation was very well justified and am shocked that people would fire into him that way when he was in the right. His post was not rude or degrading in anyway. If you want to follow his relationship example, maybe you should follow his example and learn to control your responses.......as he said, he was quite annoyed and irritated, but he didn't go around bashing anyone here, his response was quite civil.

I dont think anyone is going to post about who they like anymore.

Maybe that's the way it should be........since we've all (or almost all) used hawkeye and Melissa's relationship as an "example".....I'll do it again here........hawkeye and Melissa didn't go around publicly informing everyone of their feelings for each other (not until they were engaged--er betroved). Hawekeye did approach me once on a simi-related subject about a "friend" (yes, I am intentionally leaving details out) a couple months before they got engaged, but didn't make it known who the friend was......maybe we should take their example in this area and if we happen to like someone here, wait until it is obvioulsy God's leading (not our own unpredicatble human emotions) telling us this is the right person. If for no other reason, to keep our private lives....uh.....PRIVATE

Ok, I am gonna say one thing about the.......recent blow ups among the members, and then I won't say anything else.

Everyone, this thread was first intended to tell everyone that AM and myself were an item. Then, it turned into a 'this is what I beleive' thread. Which was perfectly fine. In fact, I enjoy such threads. But then, some people went a little over board. What you beleive is fine, but your opinion is just that; your opinion. Just because you don't think that dating is right, doesn't mean that it is the gospel truth. Just like since I think that dating is ok doesn't make it right for everyone. I care alot about AM, and just because we like each other alot, and we're an item here online, doesn't mean we're gonna run off together to Vegas and get married. So here is my advice.

Let's all agree to disagree. We can state our opinions, but let us remember that they are only our opinions. And let's try to be more considerate of other feelings and opions.

You are indeed, wise beyond your years


OK, I don't know where that came from, but I had to say it.


And now like my sis, Ami, I will withdrawl myself from this thread.....taking my own advice and keeping things in my private life private (though a good number of you will be invited to the wedding when / if it occurs).

Peace Out

-Gimp

[Trent DeWhite]

What dideth you thinketh?

The guy is hilarious and rather animated, I must say.

[Baragon]

If I've offended Hawkeye by using his relationship with Melissa as a "supposed" example, then I apologize publicly. The only reason I use them as an example is because they've done things (I.e., gotten engaged) which proves that online relationships can indeed happen. I don't agree with all their standards, but I do agree that they seem happy with each other, and I wish them the best of all blessings. However, I didn't mean to place them on a pedestal, considering they are, after all, humans. I don't consider them an example of how a perfect relationship (there is no such thing ) goes, obviously, seeing as I disagree with them, but I do use them to show that godly people can indeed make 'wise' decisions when it comes to marrying someone online.

Dogbert: Like I'd ever listen a link given by you.

[Eugene Blackgaard]

[Jessicado]

That's just mean........

[Neosha]

Well you want to know my crush then well sorry that convedentual to me and i won't tell anyone ever. it not anyone on the ToO eather

[MDB17]

awe thanks a like you too!

wait shes not talking to me is she

[Jennifer Doyle]

*LBG weighs in on the subject*

The number one word I'd use to describe dating in the sense it is used in our world today would be: pointless.

I've argued against dating, but specifically dating as teens and preteens, on another Christian board. A few of the pros of dating were, "Dating in high school helps you prepare for 'the real world.'" and "It gives you experience, and helps you know how to act when you're in a serious relationship later in life."

Watson said something I really liked, "All this 'boyfriend' and 'girlfriend' stuff is annoying. Why? Because it demonstrates a wrong attitude toward marriage. Dating seems to trivialize it, and unfortunately, it allows for "experimentation" that EB alluded.

Dr. Laura said, "Dating is practice for divorce." I think she's totally correct. In the typical secular and [more and more] Christian preteen and teen relationships, you date someone when you are romantically attracted to them. We all know that those feelings do not last forever, they fade away. And when you are dating someone and you aren't romantically attracted to them anymore, why date them anymore? So you dump the person or the person dumps you. And you move on to your next relationship.

A common enough reason that people cheat on their spouses or get divorces is because they "aren't in love anymore". Like Love is something they slipped into, got married, but when they pick themselves up and dry off, they can get a divorce.

I am 17 years old and [like I think I said before] I've never dated. I believe I'm a fairly intelligent person. I think I'm well rounded, I have a good family and church family, I love God. I don't consider myself out of touch with the world or less of a person because I've never dated or had a romantic relationship. But I think that's what our schools and media and culture in general is telling us.

This new movie, "The 40 year old virgin" is disgusting. The main character is a man who hasn't slept with anyone and his friends are going to "fix it" for him. That's the kind of culture we live in. If you haven't dated or had sex by the time you're 14, you're a weirdo and probably too sheltered. It bugs me something fierce, but I'm watching my friends from youth group go through their 3 week long relationships with kids at school and then they are heartbroken and then repeat the process...


What purpose does dating serve? I can't see a SINGLE thing dating does that being friends with and spending time with the opposite sex can't!

Long I know...I was trying to keep it novel size!

[gimp80995]

*LBG weighs in on the subject*

The number one word I'd use to describe dating in the sense it is used in our world today would be: pointless.

I've argued against dating, but specifically dating as teens and preteens, on another Christian board. A few of the pros of dating were, "Dating in high school helps you prepare for 'the real world.'" and "It gives you experience, and helps you know how to act when you're in a serious relationship later in life."

Watson said something I really liked, "All this 'boyfriend' and 'girlfriend' stuff is annoying. Why? Because it demonstrates a wrong attitude toward marriage. Dating seems to trivialize it, and unfortunately, it allows for "experimentation" that EB alluded.

Dr. Laura said, "Dating is practice for divorce." I think she's totally correct. In the typical secular and [more and more] Christian preteen and teen relationships, you date someone when you are romantically attracted to them. We all know that those feelings do not last forever, they fade away. And when you are dating someone and you aren't romantically attracted to them anymore, why date them anymore? So you dump the person or the person dumps you. And you move on to your next relationship.

A common enough reason that people cheat on their spouses or get divorces is because they "aren't in love anymore". Like Love is something they slipped into, got married, but when they pick themselves up and dry off, they can get a divorce.

I am 17 years old and [like I think I said before] I've never dated. I believe I'm a fairly intelligent person. I think I'm well rounded, I have a good family and church family, I love God. I don't consider myself out of touch with the world or less of a person because I've never dated or had a romantic relationship. But I think that's what our schools and media and culture in general is telling us.

This new movie, "The 40 year old virgin" is disgusting. The main character is a man who hasn't slept with anyone and his friends are going to "fix it" for him. That's the kind of culture we live in. If you haven't dated or had sex by the time you're 14, you're a weirdo and probably too sheltered. It bugs me something fierce, but I'm watching my friends from youth group go through their 3 week long relationships with kids at school and then they are heartbroken and then repeat the process...


What purpose does dating serve? I can't see a SINGLE thing dating does that being friends with and spending time with the opposite sex can't!

Long I know...I was trying to keep it novel size!

Verry good post LBG. OK, I knew I said I was withdrawing.......but after seeing a good post like that, I had to put in my take.

A reason I'm against teen (and especially preteen) dating is because so many times you see kids who "aren't exclusive" meaning while they're dating one person, they're also dating other people at the same time.......doesn't sound like a good way to prepare for marriage if you ask me.

Growing up I simi-regularly read Insight Magazine. There's a dating column written by and elder of a church (no, after all the years I don't remember his name) but he often talked of his own daughter (who I would assume is a Junior in College now) and said how he would prefer she didn't get involved in a dating relationship until she finished grad school and had started her carrer......OK, reading that as a 15 year old (even though I was a 15 year old with no intrest in dating) his view seemd kind of harsh.......but now that I'm older and (kinda) wiser, I can see the point........why date when you're still in school at all.......I mean you've got your entire life ahead of you to find "the right person", and if you really trust God to bring that person around, they will still be there when you're an adult and able to handle a relationship in a mature manner.

At the risk of giving out personal info I will tell you guys the bf I have now is currently my SECOND bf in my life....the first being when I was in 8th grade....the two of us (in 8th grade) had known each other since 4th grade and when we started "going out", no one was a bit supprised......everyone (including us) figured we'd be together, get done with highschool and get married........but between 8th and 9th grade both of our families moved to different states.......and while, we tried the whole long-distance thing, we were too immature at 13 /14 to do so for very long. I remember being devastated.........now I think back and wonder why anyone would intentionally put themselves through such an emotiional roller coaster at such a young age........being a teenager can be depressing enough without it.

And on the dating thing, I would agree. Even my bf and I aren't really "dating". Sorta in the middle of dating and courting. Most of the time when we're together, it's at church, or a church related event. Even though both of us are adults, we don't really go out alone. Now, we're both Christians, and would uphold Christian values, but still it's better to be in a group setting anyway.

LBG: and you just thought yours was long

Peace Out

-Gimp

[Jennifer Doyle]

And on the dating thing, I would agree. Even my bf and I aren't really "dating". Sorta in the middle of dating and courting. Most of the time when we're together, it's at church, or a church related event. Even though both of us are adults, we don't really go out alone. Now, we're both Christians, and would uphold Christian values, but still it's better to be in a group setting anyway.

I believe courting is the way to go. In a sociology class at my liberal college, I was the only person who said I'd court. [They'd shown a video that made courting look so rediculous and out there. No touching, no being alone, 1 hour visits on the weekends, 1 hour a week phone time, writting letters to each other...] The rest of the class didn't like my idea that dating was pointless. They thought you had to date someone to get to know them. I find that hilarious. Anyway, I think courting, as an adult, is the way to go!

[Baragon]

They'd shown a video that made courting look so rediculous and out there. No touching, no being alone

I'm merely wondering: You believe touching and time alone is fine, in a courtship?

[Dr. Watson]

And on the dating thing, I would agree. Even my bf and I aren't really "dating". Sorta in the middle of dating and courting. Most of the time when we're together, it's at church, or a church related event. Even though both of us are adults, we don't really go out alone. Now, we're both Christians, and would uphold Christian values, but still it's better to be in a group setting anyway.

I believe courting is the way to go. In a sociology class at my liberal college, I was the only person who said I'd court. [They'd shown a video that made courting look so rediculous and out there. No touching, no being alone, 1 hour visits on the weekends, 1 hour a week phone time, writting letters to each other...] The rest of the class didn't like my idea that dating was pointless. They thought you had to date someone to get to know them. I find that hilarious. Anyway, I think courting, as an adult, is the way to go!

And that is something else that I dislike--nearly everyone assumes dating is natural and normal without truely examining its nature. Then when a person who believes in courtship (which has been around for millenia)comes along, he/she is ignored and laughed at.

[gimp80995]

OK, I know I'm running the risk of sounding like Jared here, but I've done some research: yeah, you guys know you're in for a long read now

There are two arguments commonly raised in favour of dating. Firstly "If people don't date, how will they learn to relate with the opposite sex?" and secondly "Dating is just cultural. Our culture dates, the Jewish culture courted.".....I'm going to debunk these myths by taking them to their logical conclusions.

The first statement can be reinterpreted positively two ways "Dating teaches people how to conduct [good] relationships with the opposite sex," or "Dating is the only way people can meet their partner in our society."......If the first statement were true, then we should see a growth in strong relationships and strong marriages since the invention of dating earlier this century.....Instead, we see an exponential increase in divorce, date rape and many other stains on society. The evidence shows that dating does NOT build strong relationships at all! For the last 1900 years, people have been building good relationships with the opposite sex without dating.

What about meeting your partner? How can anyone expect to meet their mate if they don't date? I question if dating is the best environment to determine if someone has the qualities you desire in a mate....Much better opportunities lie in team ministry, or families visiting families, etc, where there is no emotional involvement, and no agenda to give a good appearance....Then partners can truly judge how that person acts in a variety of circumstances, before they even commence in their relationship.

Some people say that dating is our culture. But our culture also says that you should sleep with your partner and live together for a while before you get married, if you get married at all.....By what standard do you call the first "acceptable culture" and the second "unacceptable?" The same standard must be used to judge both, and the Bible is not ambiguous in its teaching on relationships.....How then can we justify drawing the line between emotional promiscuity vs. physical promiscuity instead of complete fidelity vs. promiscuity?

Also, getting back to what hawkeye said about talking to his dad in depth.......those of you who have said you place the Lord and / or the Bible at the center of your lives, may want to consider that in Biblical times, paretns were HIGHLY involved when it came to their children's future spouse. I know that nowadays we think of it being an "arranged marriage" where the parent says "you're going to marry ______! End of discussion", but that's not the case. The children consented, and sometimes the man would go to the woman's father and make arrangements to marry (a tradition many still hold today). At any rate, parents were involved then, and relationships lasted (like they're suppose to).

OK, I have more I could say........but I am needing to get off of here now. I might post more later.

Peace Out

-Gimp

[Dr. Watson]

OK, I know I'm running the risk of sounding like Jared here, but I've done some research: yeah, you guys know you're in for a long read now

There are two arguments commonly raised in favour of dating. Firstly "If people don't date, how will they learn to relate with the opposite sex?" and secondly "Dating is just cultural. Our culture dates, the Jewish culture courted.".....I'm going to debunk these myths by taking them to their logical conclusions.

The first statement can be reinterpreted positively two ways "Dating teaches people how to conduct [good] relationships with the opposite sex," or "Dating is the only way people can meet their partner in our society."......If the first statement were true, then we should see a growth in strong relationships and strong marriages since the invention of dating earlier this century.....Instead, we see an exponential increase in divorce, date rape and many other stains on society. The evidence shows that dating does NOT build strong relationships at all! For the last 1900 years, people have been building good relationships with the opposite sex without dating.

What about meeting your partner? How can anyone expect to meet their mate if they don't date? I question if dating is the best environment to determine if someone has the qualities you desire in a mate....Much better opportunities lie in team ministry, or families visiting families, etc, where there is no emotional involvement, and no agenda to give a good appearance....Then partners can truly judge how that person acts in a variety of circumstances, before they even commence in their relationship.

Some people say that dating is our culture. But our culture also says that you should sleep with your partner and live together for a while before you get married, if you get married at all.....By what standard do you call the first "acceptable culture" and the second "unacceptable?" The same standard must be used to judge both, and the Bible is not ambiguous in its teaching on relationships.....How then can we justify drawing the line between emotional promiscuity vs. physical promiscuity instead of complete fidelity vs. promiscuity?

Also, getting back to what hawkeye said about talking to his dad in depth.......those of you who have said you place the Lord and / or the Bible at the center of your lives, may want to consider that in Biblical times, paretns were HIGHLY involved when it came to their children's future spouse. I know that nowadays we think of it being an "arranged marriage" where the parent says "you're going to marry ______! End of discussion", but that's not the case. The children consented, and sometimes the man would go to the woman's father and make arrangements to marry (a tradition many still hold today). At any rate, parents were involved then, and relationships lasted (like they're suppose to).

OK, I have more I could say........but I am needing to get off of here now. I might post more later.

Peace Out

-Gimp

Excellent post. I've heard the "arranged marriage" line before. When anything smacks of using a proper authority structure, (aka "parents"), they cry "arranged marriage!"

[Jennifer Doyle]

I'm merely wondering: You believe touching and time alone is fine, in a courtship?

I draw the line at holding hands. I want to kiss my husband at the alter. I think alone time is fine, but not in a bedroom, or a car, or a movie theater, etc. How about in the living room, someone on the couch and the other in a chair. I don't see anything wrong with that.

Again, these are young adults we're talking about, not 16 year olds...I think two adults can be alone in the same room.

[The Top Crusader]

I'm merely wondering: You believe touching and time alone is fine, in a courtship?

I draw the line at holding hands. I want to kiss my husband at the alter. I think alone time is fine, but not in a bedroom, or a car, or a movie theater, etc. How about in the living room, someone on the couch and the other in a chair. I don't see anything wrong with that.

Again, these are young adults we're talking about, not 16 year olds...I think two adults can be alone in the same room.

I don't know that I 100% agree, but I think it is awesome for someone to wait until they are married for their first kiss--that would certainly make it memoriable! Not that I would know anything about kissing... but anyway, I just want to clarify, by alone in the car do you mean totally not at all, or just "parked"?

[Dr. Watson]

I'm merely wondering: You believe touching and time alone is fine, in a courtship?

I draw the line at holding hands. I want to kiss my husband at the alter. I think alone time is fine, but not in a bedroom, or a car, or a movie theater, etc. How about in the living room, someone on the couch and the other in a chair. I don't see anything wrong with that.

Again, these are young adults we're talking about, not 16 year olds...I think two adults can be alone in the same room.

I would a go a little bit farther --I believe in a courting couple not touching at all. Thus their first physical contact *ever* is when they are married. As for time alone, young adults are equally prone to temptation as younger teens. I think in Victorian times, the common practice was for the courting couple to take a walk together with the parents trailing a little bit behind.

[The Top Crusader]

But imagine the horror if you got married, and found when you touched your wife for the first time, that she had slimy skin!? THEN WHAT!!??

[Baragon]

Just because I've enjoyed this discussion so far, I do believe I'll enter in again, as time allows.

There are two arguments commonly raised in favour of dating. Firstly "If people don't date, how will they learn to relate with the opposite sex?" and secondly "Dating is just cultural. Our culture dates, the Jewish culture courted.".....

I'm pro-dating and I don't prescribe to those arguments.

Also, getting back to what hawkeye said about talking to his dad in depth.......those of you who have said you place the Lord and / or the Bible at the center of your lives, may want to consider that in Biblical times, paretns were HIGHLY involved when it came to their children's future spouse. I know that nowadays we think of it being an "arranged marriage" where the parent says "you're going to marry ______! End of discussion", but that's not the case. The children consented, and sometimes the man would go to the woman's father and make arrangements to marry (a tradition many still hold today). At any rate, parents were involved then, and relationships lasted (like they're suppose to).

There's nothing at all wrong with having parents involved. I don't think anyone here has said they've got a problem with such parental involvement. The issue is, sometimes couples would like time alone. However, at the same time, while I believe dating is acceptable, I demand that whoever desires to ask for my hand in marriage, must ask my father\mother before they ask me. The permission must be given before such an engagement occurs. It is simply important that the parents consent. However, it is not a Biblical mandate, nor a Biblical arrangement that we must have our parents hanging all over us while we're with someone of the opposite gender, so the argument that "just because people in the Bible did it, we should do it, too" doesn't hold up (That's being said in a kind manner). I could use the same argument that since women wear burkas in the middle east, we should too, since it keeps men from having a problem with women in public. If two people aren't mature enough to be in a room alone, without their parents there, they simply shouldn't be dating\courting\betrothing. Period. End of discussion. I have no issue with those people who think that courting\dating\betrothing is the proper way to go about things. Everyone has their own choice as to the method by which they get to know their spouse -- as long as it is done in a moral manner -- but I do take issue with those who claim that one method is Biblically commanded or preferred. It simply isn't true.

Further, marriages now days can last a long time (like they're supposed to) but I don't blame "dating" for the marriages that don't last. There are indeed more issues in a marriage that can cause problems, than just the way they came to be a married couple.

On another note, I do pray that not everyone dates just anyone they put their eyes on. I surely don't agree with such a method, nor do I encourage it. I realize that unfortunately, such a method does happen in today's culture, but I do not at all believe that all dating has to be looked upon as a horrible method which prescribes immorality. However, the Bible has laid out the moral guidelines for a relationship, and I see dating\courting\betrothing (whatever you wish to call it) as fitting into that, when done in a conservative manner, and with God as the foundation of the relationship. Many people I've known have dated, and even married the very first person they dated, and have had happy, long, goldy marriages.

And with all that said, I do believe I'll have to end this agreeing to disagree.

Again, these are young adults we're talking about, not 16 year olds...I think two adults can be alone in the same room.

I don't agree that two young adults can't go to a theater, or even be in a car alone, but I am glad that we agree on the above, at least (I.e., two adults can be alone in the same room alone).

Anyone want the money I earned from this long post?