At the Second Church of Odyssey you'll find different ways of expressing your beliefs, finding prayer support or being encouraged through regular devotionals.
King Butter Turtle wrote:Overall, I agree with most of what your saying; that we shouldn't spend money selfishly. But, your whole thing about how God has a specific purpose for each dollar that we give and consequently we should save all of the money we get so we can pray and be very very careful in giving it, is kind of crazy. God doesn't completely run the whole world. (he could if he wanted to but, he's given us a free will) You seem to be suggesting that we're all just puppets and we give whatever/whenever/to whomever God tells us and that's that. Of course we should be careful and pray about it and everything but, in the end, you have to make a decision. You can't just wait for some kind of divine message before you put anything in the plate. We should read the Bible and look to the example of Jesus for guidance in our giving and there you'll find giving freely, regularly, cheerfully and sacrificially.
I was not intending to sound as if we are puppets or that God has a specific purpose for every dollar. However, should we not seek His guidance on where the BEST place to use our money is? It seems that He would know, considering that He knows everything that's going on in the world...and yes, there are times when we just need to step out and use the money where we think is best, and trust that He'll work the details out. But sometimes I think He does have a plan, and if you don't do it, He'll find someone else to do it.
Yes, the specifics of which charities/causes/whatever you give to and which stores/companies you spend at for yourself, for that matter, is all a between-you-and-God thing. But, as for the general, big-picture Christian philosophy on money, we are to look to the scriptures (especially the word's and actions of Jesus).
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As for the story about your pastor, he wasn't saving for himself so, that's not really what we're talking about.
SoccerLOTR wrote:and by the way...saving money for college is not wasting your money...it is preparing for the future. And not all college kids spend college drunk and messing their lives up. Just for the record.
Well, if it's for something specific that you know God's called you to do, that's one thing. But, if you're spending tens of thousands of dollars to get a degree in general studies because that's what all your friends did and then you go on to become a stay-at-home mom and never use it, in a world in which hundreds of millions, maybe even billions of people don't have even have a high school diploma, that's wrong! Also, it's different if the student is paying for themselves. Ramsey suggests that you set aside 50/60 grand per kid from the time they're babies on the expectation that they'll go to college.
Dave Ramsey wrote:So, um, what we told our children was that they had to go to school and that it really wasn’t an option and, um, so, we brainwashed ‘em. ‘This is your college fund. This is your college fund. This is your college fund. This is your college fund. This is your college fund.’ And, that’s why- you know, that’s why an E.S.A. makes sense.
I feel like you're trying to make us more different than we are. Half the time I'm saying something along the lines of what you say, then you feel you must correct me and tell me "that's not really what we're talking about" and re-direct me towards supposing that I'm agreeing with this guy that I don't know anything about. This is getting frustrating.
I'm not saying we should stash tons and tons of money away "just because". That's not why God blesses us with money...same goes for talents and skills and gifts that we don't use for Him because of some meager excuse of "i'm not the best..." or "i don't want to be in charge..." The age old question--what good is love if you don't act it out and show it? (1 Corinthians 13) How do we show that we are acting in faith and doing everything for God if we don't do anything with what He gives us? (James 2) I'm saying that there are legitimate reasons for putting money away that will ultimately bring glory to God. Sometimes we are to give it away immediately...other times it is to give away and use at another time in the future. Yes, people all over the world are starving today. And guess what? As sad as it is, five years from now there will STILL be people all over the world starving. The money will be needed just as much then as it is now, and if there is a plan that goes along with it, there's good reason to save it for the future. Not to be used for the 5th Cadillac (as some of the televangelists have done, which HORRIFIES me)...but for helping others.
As for the college thing...Yes, I agree that it is ridiculous when people spend thousands of dollars on a fancy education just to stay at home or work factory or trade-type jobs that aren't learned at college. BUT, I also don't think it's wrong for parents to save some money to help their kids get through college. However, it shouldn't be a "this is your college fund, this is your college fund" brainwashing thing as your quote says--just an agreement that IF their kids choose to go, they will help them. And if their kids decide not to go, they should take that money and give it to the church or to help missionaries or to do ministry in one way or another--not force their kids through college and thus waste the money.
And for the couch/house/car thoughts/issue...I don't think it's wrong to occasionally buy something nice, so long as it's not expensive and extravagant. There are things you can use those nicer things for...for example, having a welcoming environment so that others can visit (some have the gift of hospitality) and be blessed by what you do for them while they are there. And having a room open so that people in need of some temporary housing can stay can be good too. If a missionary, for example, comes to stay in a town for a couple weeks, does the church spend a bunch of money to put them in an unwelcoming, impersonal hotel room? Or would it be better if someone in the church opened their house for them to stay in for a short time? If someone is blessed with a larger home, that is what they should be doing. (When Jesus sent the disciples out, He said to stay with someone in the town wherever they went...some people must have had enough money and space to put them up for a couple nights.) It is not necessary to live in a home with dirt floors and no beds in order to serve God and help others...just have to be careful that you are actually USING this stuff for Him, rather than just having the extra room to stash more junk in. And especially for the older people in the church, having some money saved up so that they don't have to be begging for help for themselves is a positive thing. If they have extra money, many enjoy the ability to continue helping others monetarily, because they are no longer physically able to volunteer for hours at the local soup kitchen.
All of these are examples of what one can do with money AND be serving God. Tons of extra money = foolish waste...a bit to save in case of emergency and the means to help others in various ways = good. As is said multiple times in the New Testament...the Church is a body, all with different functions who have different gifts and abilities that all contribute to the good of others in MANY ways...not just one or two ways that are most quickly seen to be beneficial.
It was good knowing you StrongNChrist; you taught me a lot. I'll meet you someday for real in God's presence.
Which Jesus do you follow? If Ephesians says to imitate Christ, why do you look so much like the world?~Todd Agnew
Do not be anxious about anything...~Phil 4:6-7
If more of us valued food, cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.~Tolkien
Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost.~J Adams
Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.~B Franklin
I died and became a Roman Soldier--It was rather distracting.~Rory (Dr.Who)
It seems that He would know, considering that He knows everything that's going on in the world...and yes, there are times when we just need to step out and use the money where we think is best, and trust that He'll work the details out. But sometimes I think He does have a plan, and if you don't do it, He'll find someone else to do it.
Just for the record.
This is getting frustrating. 
as your quote says--just an agreement that IF their kids choose to go, they will help them. And if their kids decide not to go, they should take that money and give it to the church or to help missionaries or to do ministry in one way or another--not force their kids through college and thus waste the money.
