613: The Top Floor, Part III

Taq · Post by **Taq** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 7:27 pm

Wow, that was a really exciting listening experience. An explosion, the good guys worming through tight security, Dalton powering out of the elevator, two $50,000 vases shattered knocking out two Whittakers—there was a ton of action keeping me on the edge of my seat.

Wow, that was a really good lesson. The Eugene/Leonard dialogues about providence and faith in Part I and Whit/Leonard conversation about Whit being prepared for death in Part III were fitting. The issues were so naturally woven into the story.

Jason made a grand entrance and didn’t disappoint; I hope he sticks around. Katrina displayed wit and intelligence; I hope to see more of that. Though we’ve only known him for a short time, Dalton turned out to be a great villain. That security lady Vasquez was weird, but she served her purpose. Everett was a sincere kid. The different father/son combinations did well.

When I get around to compiling a top ten list, The Top Floor will be on it. I’ve already listened to all parts multiple times. Kudos to Nathan for writing an excellent trio and to the cast and crew for great execution.

Oh, Rock, Rim, and Tower is such a cool name!

Post by **Catspaw** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 9:24 pm

Many kudos to Nathan Hoobler for a fabulous three-parter! $\:D/$

Also, yay for Vasquez's line "It was a boring conversation anyway," because it totally reminded me of Han Solo's line in Star Wars IV: A New Hope while he and Luke are impersonating Stormtroopers right before they rescue Leia, when he shoots that communication thing. Also, the vase thing reminded me of Jason's line in "A Name, Not a Number" when he hits Filby over the head and says "Sorry about the vase, Dad." Then it hit me (figuratively, of course

- it's a tiny bit like when Indiana Jones's father hits him over the head in the third Indy movie, The Last Crusade. $\:D/$ Different, but enough for me to think happy thought about Harrison Ford.

I did like the episode for far more than that, but other people have already said those things quite well! $\:D/$ It will be interesting to see what happens with Everett and Leonard in the future. Some people wanted to see what Eugene would do with a child of his own, but I think that a brother could serve a similar purpose.

Kairi · Post by **Kairi** » Sun Mar 11, 2007 2:08 pm

I enjoyed this extremely! Yay for Everett! I hope to hear much more from Leonard and Everett. The music and the acting was great. I enjoyed the humor. All-in-all, a 5 star episode!

Applesauce · Post by **Applesauce** » Mon Mar 12, 2007 8:39 pm

Despite my overall dislike of part 1, and my neutral feelings about 2, this episode was really good. Unlike the first two parts, the suspense was actually suspenseful (I wasn't jumping out of my chair or anything, but at least it kept me guessing), and all the sneaking around in the apartment was fun to listen to. I also liked Dalton's capture. Sure, it may have been "easy", but if it hadn't ended that way, we wouldn't have had that touching scene between him and Everett. Speaking of which, I really liked the Dalton/Everett relationship. It made me genuinely concerned over how the episode would end and what would happen to Everett. For that reason, I now hope that Dalton does return someday. I ended up liking his character by the end of the episode (and if only he appeared earlier in the saga, I might have liked him before now).

My rating for this episode: 5 stars.
My overall rating for all three parts: 4 stars.

Flyah · Post by **Flyah** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 5:18 pm

Bad enough for Eugene to have a father, now a brother (!) Yikes. Kind of takes the sting and power out of an episode like Last in a Long Line (among others) What's next - a long-lost step-sister for Connie? Jerry didn't die in Vietnam, he's just been in hiding to reappear and take over the Electric Palace?

I don't like this storyline (I know most do - I just liked the reality of Eugene's loss of his parents and changing his background hurts if not the integrity of the show and it's earlier writers, certainly renders the time I've spent listening and investing in these characters shaky at best.

SweetJoy93 · Post by **SweetJoy93** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 8:34 pm

Amazing episode!!! It totally caught me off guard the fact that evert acturly loved his "Father" I just assumed that he wouldn't but it was nice that there was some good in whatever that bad guys name was life!!

Ferder · Post by **Ferder** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 8:55 pm

Flyah wrote:I don't like this storyline (I know most do - I just liked the reality of Eugene's loss of his parents and changing his background hurts if not the integrity of the show and it's earlier writers, certainly renders the time I've spent listening and investing in these characters shaky at best.

That's why I don't really consider any of these new episodes "cannon." It's just stuff made up by the new writers to try and spice things up.

Trent DeWhite · Post by **Trent DeWhite** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 8:57 pm

Flyah wrote:Bad enough for Eugene to have a father, now a brother (!) Yikes. Kind of takes the sting and power out of an episode like Last in a Long Line (among others) What's next - a long-lost step-sister for Connie? Jerry didn't die in Vietnam, he's just been in hiding to reappear and take over the Electric Palace?

Your justification for not enjoying this turn of events is a slippery slope argument and not one which has much credence. However, you are entitled to your opinion and I won't argue with it. I just don't like your rationale.

Elgian · Post by **Elgian** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 9:09 pm

I think Flyah finally pinned down why I haven't been all that interested in the whole Leonard/Eugene arc. That and I just was never... I dunno, drawn into the characters.

Jonathan · Post by **Jonathan** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 9:23 pm

Trent DeWhite wrote:
Flyah wrote:Bad enough for Eugene to have a father, now a brother (!) Yikes. Kind of takes the sting and power out of an episode like Last in a Long Line (among others) What's next - a long-lost step-sister for Connie? Jerry didn't die in Vietnam, he's just been in hiding to reappear and take over the Electric Palace?
You're justification for not enjoying this turn of events is a slippery slope argument and not one which has much credence. However, you are entitled to your opinion and I won't argue with it. I just don't like your rationale.

Pardon me for being a tad undiplomatic, but you haven't liked anyone's rationale who hasn't been just thrilled with this arc. We don't like it, and have good reasons for it. Nothing wrong with that.

Trent DeWhite · Post by **Trent DeWhite** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 9:29 pm

Jonathan wrote:
Trent DeWhite wrote:Your justification for not enjoying this turn of events is a slippery slope argument and not one which has much credence. However, you are entitled to your opinion and I won't argue with it. I just don't like your rationale.
Pardon me for being a tad undiplomatic, but you haven't liked anyone's rationale who hasn't been just thrilled with this arc. We don't like it, and have good reasons for it. Nothing wrong with that.

I'm not jumping on you for your opinion. I don't have to agree with it and you don't have to agree with mine.

Flyah · Post by **Flyah** » Fri Mar 16, 2007 7:07 am

Trent DeWhite wrote:
Flyah wrote:Bad enough for Eugene to have a father, now a brother (!) Yikes. Kind of takes the sting and power out of an episode like Last in a Long Line (among others) What's next - a long-lost step-sister for Connie? Jerry didn't die in Vietnam, he's just been in hiding to reappear and take over the Electric Palace?
Your justification for not enjoying this turn of events is a slippery slope argument and not one which has much credence. However, you are entitled to your opinion and I won't argue with it. I just don't like your rationale.

My rationale is full of credence. What I'm stating is that after investing in these characters, you feel like your legs have been chopped out from beneath you because they can just rewrite history.

Seriously, what is stopping them from bringing Jerry back? I don't believe it's a slippery slope. As you said we're both entitled to our opinions, however, the way I reached mine is not without credibility.

Sonuna · Post by **Sonuna** » Fri Mar 16, 2007 9:06 am

Flyah wrote:What I'm stating is that after investing in these characters, you feel like your legs have been chopped out from beneath you because they can just rewrite history.

This is one of the accepted rights of writers of the show. Or any fictional canon. Retconning is hardly a new concept, and this potential past interpretation has a not-insignificant possibility of having occurred; it is not directly contradicted by any past claims.
Ergo, I conclude your position is one of personal taste, in the same way as I personally found this arc somewhat enjoyable.

Flyah · Post by **Flyah** » Fri Mar 16, 2007 9:30 am

sonuna wrote:
Flyah wrote:What I'm stating is that after investing in these characters, you feel like your legs have been chopped out from beneath you because they can just rewrite history.
This is one of the accepted rights of writers of the show. Or any fictional canon. Retconning is hardly a new concept, and this potential past interpretation has a not-insignificant possibility of having occurred; it is not directly contradicted by any past claims.
Ergo, I conclude your position is one of personal taste, in the same way as I personally found this arc somewhat enjoyable.

Sincere question: If a story arc included the return of Jerry, what would your reaction be?

Shadowpaw · Post by **Shadowpaw** » Fri Mar 16, 2007 12:43 pm

Flyah wrote:My rationale is full of credence. What I'm stating is that after investing in these characters, you feel like your legs have been chopped out from beneath you because they can just rewrite history.

Seriously, what is stopping them from bringing Jerry back? I don't believe it's a slippery slope. As you said we're both entitled to our opinions, however, the way I reached mine is not without credibility.

Well I think the difference is that Jerry has always been considered dead, whereas Eugene's parents were always considered lost. Even as a kid I wondered if Eugene's parents were still out there somewhere, as there was never any bodies found and the was never any confirmation of their death... only that they were never heard from again and assumed dead because they were lost on an archaelogical expedition.

Don't get me wrong though, I hated that they brought Robert Mitchell back to life and I would feel even worse if they brought Jerry back. But Eugene's parents are a different story, as the way "Last in a Long Line" was told opened the door to the possibility that Eugene's parents were still alive. That's a belief I held as a kid and I was never given the answer until over a decade later. Nathan and I even had a discussion several years ago in which we discussed how it was possible for Eugene's parents to still be alive. We both had similar interpretations when we heard "Last in a Long Line" and it's not outside the realm of possibility that Paul McCusker and Phil Lollar eventually intended to delve deeper into that possibility and never got around to it.

As for Everett, yeah, I don't like that Eugene has a brother and I don't think it was necessary to bring him into the picture. There are certainly times where AIO seems like a bad soap opera, and that's an example of it (I mean, an evil man steals a child from the woman he loves and raises him as his own and uses the parents as slaves?) But as for Leonard being alive and well, I'm fine with that... though I'm still annoyed at several other inconsistencies with the overall Leonard arc (such as Thelma "Mushnik").

Sonuna · Post by **Sonuna** » Fri Mar 16, 2007 1:01 pm

Flyah wrote:
sonuna wrote:
Flyah wrote:What I'm stating is that after investing in these characters, you feel like your legs have been chopped out from beneath you because they can just rewrite history.
This is one of the accepted rights of writers of the show. Or any fictional canon. Retconning is hardly a new concept, and this potential past interpretation has a not-insignificant possibility of having occurred; it is not directly contradicted by any past claims.
Ergo, I conclude your position is one of personal taste, in the same way as I personally found this arc somewhat enjoyable.
Sincere question: If a story arc included the return of Jerry, what would your reaction be?

I would be irritated, because Jerry's death is presented as a death, not a missing-presumed-death as with LM/EM. There is, I believe, a significant distinction. From my admittedly minimal investigations I received the perhaps misguided impression that a body or other, similar evidence existed.

Laurie · Post by **Laurie** » Fri Mar 16, 2007 1:11 pm

In reference to Jerry we do know that he is dead. In the episode "The Decision" Jack tells Joanne (they are talking about Whit) that Whit's oldest son is buried in the local cemetery. Even in the episode "The Very Best Friends" Whit tells Donna that Jerry is in the same place as Karen. So, in Jerry's instance we do have a body. We have never had a body in the case(s) of Leonard and Everett. It was my understanding as well listening to "Last in a Long Line" that Leonard and Everett were not dead, but alive.

Jonathan · Post by **Jonathan** » Fri Mar 16, 2007 4:32 pm

Laurie wrote:In reference to Jerry we do know that he is dead. In the episode "The Decision" Jack tells Joanne (they are talking about Whit) that Whit's oldest son is buried in the local cemetery. Even in the episode "The Very Best Friends" Whit tells Donna that Jerry is in the same place as Karen. So, in Jerry's instance we do have a body. We have never had a body in the case(s) of Leonard and Everett. It was my understanding as well listening to "Last in a Long Line" that Leonard and Everett were not dead, but alive.

Let's explore this.

In the case of Leonard, we had a grave, in Odyssey. But haha, just kidding, there he is. Same with Everett. Before this, we were given the impression that they were dead. How many times were we told that Eugene's parents were killed in an archeological expidition?

So really, thanks to this new storyline, we don't have a body with Jerry, just a grave. I mean, think about it. Jerry could've been alive this time, and mistaken for some other poor soilder that was blown, and I mean blown, up. False identification, and all that jazz. But there is still a headstone. Yep.

I agree with Bennet, we've been put on the slope.

And I'm slightly irrated by that fact.

edit-Just say Sonuna's post.

Everett, I guess, is debatable.

But Leonard was presented as dead! We were told, numerous times that he and Eugene's Mom were killed. Numerous times. And no one else (cept a select few) seems to have a problem with this fact.

Trent DeWhite · Post by **Trent DeWhite** » Fri Mar 16, 2007 4:34 pm

Jonathan wrote:I agree with Bennet, we've been put on the slope.

Where does he say that?

Jonathan wrote:But Leonard was presented as dead! We were told, numerous times that he and Eugene's Mom were killed. Numerous times. And no one else (cept a select few) seems to have a problem with this fact.

...basically.

Jonathan · Post by **Jonathan** » Fri Mar 16, 2007 4:36 pm

Trent DeWhite wrote:
Jonathan wrote:I agree with Bennet, we've been put on the slope.
Where does he say that?

Jonathan wrote:But Leonard was presented as dead! We were told, numerous times that he and Eugene's Mom were killed. Numerous times. And no one else (cept a select few) seems to have a problem with this fact.
...basically.

Whoops, my bad. I thought he did, but that turned out to be Flyah, but it wasn't. Close though.

So I'm saying it, looking at the series since Blackgaard's Revenge... >_>

The Town of Odyssey

613: The Top Floor, Part III

Rate "The Top Floor, Part III" (with wonderfully imaginative titles...)