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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 12:50 pm 
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radgeek wrote:
Blitz wrote:
WE TREAT MALARIA BETTER THAN YOU AMERICAN.
See we are not hopeless peoples. You Americans get rid of malaria for oh a few month at the most, and it comes back. We get rid of it.

I reject your American Stereotype. :noway: We keep it away for a few years.

WE GET RID OF IT FOR GOOD. (we just get it again and again from mosquitoes.)
Odyssey is picking up the "8-12" title again. :(

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:04 pm 
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Forgive my ignorance, but... this a problem?

If you have a problem, don't listen to the show, or write a letter to them saying how wrong they are. Tell them to stop making episodes like this.

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:08 pm 
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Blitz wrote:
Odyssey is picking up the "8-12" title again. :(

...why? Didn't they learn their lesson after the splits?


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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 2:35 pm 
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Whitty Whit wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but... this a problem?

If you have a problem, don't listen to the show, or write a letter to them saying how wrong they are. Tell them to stop making episodes like this.

You're missing the point. This is a poor piece of marketing and is offensive and VERY problematic. None of us (as far as I can tell) have even heard the episode, so we're not judging it. We ARE judging an abuse of stereotypes and cultural ignorance for the sake of a marketing campaign. Your dismissive attitude is sort of counter-productive. :|

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 5:28 pm 
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Jelly wrote:
Reddo wrote:
The story revolves around two tribes that are disagreeing about who owns a heard of cattle that are roaming around free around the country side. there are machine guns too, not just spears

It's a good thing Whit is there to read the Bible to them until they stop.

Whit is the paragon of saintly missionaries: instead of cowering in fear from the machine gun- and spear-wielding natives, he and the others press on heroically.
I'll be nice after this. As long as they don't solve the dilemma in one episode.
Jelly wrote:

Whitty Whit wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but... this a problem?

If you have a problem, don't listen to the show, or write a letter to them saying how wrong they are. Tell them to stop making episodes like this.

You're missing the point. This is a poor piece of marketing and is offensive and VERY problematic. None of us (as far as I can tell) have even heard the episode, so we're not judging it. We ARE judging an abuse of stereotypes and cultural ignorance for the sake of a marketing campaign. Your dismissive attitude is sort of counter-productive. :|

A flippant, apathetic attitude towards the situation is, as Jelly said, not conducive to the situation. If you don't understand or don't even care and would rather remain ignorant, then you don't have to bother. Really.

The Old Judge wrote:
When you think of the 8-12 year old range that Odyssey is for, this advertising should work. Those obnoxious commercials selling products with no substance (i.e., the hats that can flip their arms) are for that age group. When I was that young, I probably would have been intrigued and wanted to listen to the episode.

(Technically, I still am intrigued. Just not $15/month intrigued.)

So because those hyped-up, often garish commercials for highly processed food should work. .that makes it all right? (This is not a debate about nutrition, but that's the first example that came to mind >.>) As Tiger said, just because something should/can work doesn't mean it's the way to go about it. Fostering an attitude of the stereotypes of Africa *should/will* work, but in no way means that's what needs to be done. I'm amazed at the ignorance that's rampant in the Western society, and not just about Africa. .but about a lot of the world beyond the comfortable little home they've created for themselves, somewhat like the image of an ostrich with its head stuck in the ground. And it's not only the kids. .it's teenagers and even adults. And where does it start? From here, when people are at some of the most impressionable times of their lives. Otherwise, the final product is a race full of people who really just don't know any better.

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 6:58 pm 
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Thank you, Marvin. That is exactly it.

This isn't a debate about whether or not stereotypes are used to market things; this is a debate about whether or not using such a technique, especially for AIO, is morally right. Just because Focus on the Family is a company does not mean that they should perpetuate stereotypes in their marketing like every other company does. Besides, if we consider "everybody else is doing it" to be a poor excuse for people individually, why don't we hold companies like Focus, who claim to be trying to spread the Gospel, to the same standard?

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 8:58 pm 
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Marvin D. wrote:
Jelly wrote:

Whitty Whit wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but... this a problem?

If you have a problem, don't listen to the show, or write a letter to them saying how wrong they are. Tell them to stop making episodes like this.

You're missing the point. This is a poor piece of marketing and is offensive and VERY problematic. None of us (as far as I can tell) have even heard the episode, so we're not judging it. We ARE judging an abuse of stereotypes and cultural ignorance for the sake of a marketing campaign. Your dismissive attitude is sort of counter-productive. :|

A flippant, apathetic attitude towards the situation is, as Jelly said, not conducive to the situation. If you don't understand or don't even care and would rather remain ignorant, then you don't have to bother. Really.


I beg to differ: I am not at all apathetic about it. I outlined a course of action you could take to prevent this from happening ever again. it's just that i personally don't care but i have enough heart to want to stop your complaining.

That's far more than *any* of you have done up to this point; "all I've seen so far is people complaining about it but doing nothing. I would really love to see AiO not stereotype again because obviously you hate stereotyping WAY to much.

Or am I wrong?"

edit: fixed some grammatical errors and coding.
edit 2: added parts in quotes

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 9:58 am 
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Marvin D. wrote:
So because those hyped-up, often garish commercials for highly processed food should work. .that makes it all right? (This is not a debate about nutrition, but that's the first example that came to mind >.>) As Tiger said, just because something should/can work doesn't mean it's the way to go about it. Fostering an attitude of the stereotypes of Africa *should/will* work, but in no way means that's what needs to be done. I'm amazed at the ignorance that's rampant in the Western society, and not just about Africa. .but about a lot of the world beyond the comfortable little home they've created for themselves, somewhat like the image of an ostrich with its head stuck in the ground. And it's not only the kids. .it's teenagers and even adults. And where does it start? From here, when people are at some of the most impressionable times of their lives. Otherwise, the final product is a race full of people who really just don't know any better.

BAM. This right here.

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 10:53 am 
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Yeahhh, I've always been under the impression that Africa is a tribal desert and Marvin is the only one to somehow have internet access.

Thanks a lot, Odyssey. ;)

I remember also that the Meltsners' trip to Africa was pretty primal. They had to be dropped off via airplane because the there was no civilization below. If this stereotype is misleading, it's definitely not exclusive to the OAC.

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 10:59 am 
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American Eagle wrote:
Yeahhh, I've always been under the impression that Africa is a tribal desert and Marvin is the only one to somehow have internet access.

Thanks a lot, Odyssey. ;)

I remember also that the Meltsners' trip to Africa was pretty primal. They had to be dropped off via airplane because the there was no civilization below. If this stereotype is misleading, it's definitely not exclusive to the OAC.

Don't get me wrong--there ARE extremely isolated villages with little to no contact with civilization, but not at all like most people think. And those tribal outfits? They're mostly worn for special events, not on a daily basis. If I happen to tell someone that we have a *gasp* authorized Apple Store, it's like their whole worldview has been forever altered and everything they've believed is a lie :p

Whitty Whit wrote:
Marvin D. wrote:
Jelly wrote:

Whitty Whit wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but... this a problem?

If you have a problem, don't listen to the show, or write a letter to them saying how wrong they are. Tell them to stop making episodes like this.

You're missing the point. This is a poor piece of marketing and is offensive and VERY problematic. None of us (as far as I can tell) have even heard the episode, so we're not judging it. We ARE judging an abuse of stereotypes and cultural ignorance for the sake of a marketing campaign. Your dismissive attitude is sort of counter-productive. :|

A flippant, apathetic attitude towards the situation is, as Jelly said, not conducive to the situation. If you don't understand or don't even care and would rather remain ignorant, then you don't have to bother. Really.


I beg to differ: I am not at all apathetic about it. I outlined a course of action you could take to prevent this from happening ever again. it's just that i personally don't care but i have enough heart to want to stop your complaining.

That's far more than *any* of you have done up to this point; "all I've seen so far is people complaining about it but doing nothing. I would really love to see AiO not stereotype again because obviously you hate stereotyping WAY to much.

Or am I wrong?"

edit: fixed some grammatical errors and coding.
edit 2: added parts in quotes

. . .

Wow.

"I am not at all apathetic...I personally don't care." If that's not the definition of apathetic, then what is it? You *are* apathetic. You just don't care. You, "have a heart to want to stop your complaining." It's cbriggs45 all over again. Are we complaining about a stereotype or bringing it to light here? The first step to dealing with an issue is awareness. So, let's look at your outlined plan.

1. Don't listen to the show. Yes, because that's going to do a world of good. Where will we go if we just on our hands and quit listening?
2. Tell them to stop making episodes. All right, really? With the OAC, different people raised different solutions and voiced their concerns over the many months prior to its release, but ultimately, not much was done. Writing some letters to Focus and demanding that they "stop making these episodes" is frankly childish and short-sighted. Also, it's not even the episode that's the problem right now. It's more the means of advertisement, as we've made clear.

In short, you admitted yourself to not caring. If anything, what you're doing comes off as very smug and condescending, taking time out of your busy schedule to aid the hopeless people who have no idea what to do. No. No. If you don't even care, then don't. You say that we "obviously hate stereotyping way too much," implying that you don't. Do you understand what a stereotype even is and what it does? Do you understand the damage that these stereotypes have had over the years? You don't seem to know or bother. If you wish to remain willfully ignorant, do so. But do not pass judgment in such a willy-nilly fashion and come off like a high-minded, condescending individual. Your attitude is detrimental >.>

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 12:09 pm 
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People actually asked my mom is we lived in trees.... You Americans are lost. As missionaries, we generally hate stereotypes.

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 12:27 pm 
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Blitz wrote:
You Americans are lost. As missionaries, we generally hate stereotypes.

Was this meant to be ironic? ;)

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 1:34 pm 
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Blitz wrote:
radgeek wrote:
Blitz wrote:
WE TREAT MALARIA BETTER THAN YOU AMERICAN.
See we are not hopeless peoples. You Americans get rid of malaria for oh a few month at the most, and it comes back. We get rid of it.

I reject your American Stereotype. :noway: We keep it away for a few years.

WE GET RID OF IT FOR GOOD. (we just get it again and again from mosquitoes.)

Then how do you know you got rid of it. Just going by what Church (he is American but has more medical knowledge on the subject than me) and missionaries that left Africa (who got it there and had it "rid of" there) have told me.

I don't think Witty's idea of letter writing is childish. Personally I don't see this as that much of a reason to get my panties in a knot. I just believe that by presenting a stereotype they are undermining their stated goal of provoking interest in missions. My sister (Humbleness) is called to Japan. But not because of stereotypes but because of real people. After all that is who God cares about and who we need to win. Real people.

OK maybe my panties should be in a knot.

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Blitz: You Americans are lost. As missionaries, we generally hate stereotypes.
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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 1:43 pm 
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Because if we didn't get rid of it I would be sick every few month. I rarely get malaria that much. Seriously, it is verified by countless other missionaries. They take African medicine when they go to America.
Not it is meant to mean what it means. ;)

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Blitz....do not flirt when you have a gf already!!!! Gahhhhhh..these tweens need to learn proper gentlemanly behaviour!!!
Blitz: I am a teen
* Black_Ghost buries the two peeps...err chicks...err dude and a chick
'Here lies blitz the dude, and IT the chick.
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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 5:11 pm 
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*put quotes in spoilers because I don't wanna be the guy who everybody flames at for stacking*

Marvin D. wrote:

Whitty Whit wrote:
Marvin D. wrote:
Jelly wrote:

Whitty Whit wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but... this a problem?

If you have a problem, don't listen to the show, or write a letter to them saying how wrong they are. Tell them to stop making episodes like this.

You're missing the point. This is a poor piece of marketing and is offensive and VERY problematic. None of us (as far as I can tell) have even heard the episode, so we're not judging it. We ARE judging an abuse of stereotypes and cultural ignorance for the sake of a marketing campaign. Your dismissive attitude is sort of counter-productive. :|

A flippant, apathetic attitude towards the situation is, as Jelly said, not conducive to the situation. If you don't understand or don't even care and would rather remain ignorant, then you don't have to bother. Really.


I beg to differ: I am not at all apathetic about it. I outlined a course of action you could take to prevent this from happening ever again. it's just that i personally don't care but i have enough heart to want to stop your complaining.

That's far more than *any* of you have done up to this point; "all I've seen so far is people complaining about it but doing nothing. I would really love to see AiO not stereotype again because obviously you hate stereotyping WAY to much.

Or am I wrong?"

edit: fixed some grammatical errors and coding.
edit 2: added parts in quotes

. . .

Wow.

"I am not at all apathetic...I personally don't care." If that's not the definition of apathetic, then what is it? You *are* apathetic. You just don't care. You, "have a heart to want to stop your complaining." It's cbriggs45 all over again. Are we complaining about a stereotype or bringing it to light here? The first step to dealing with an issue is awareness. So, let's look at your outlined plan.

1. Don't listen to the show. Yes, because that's going to do a world of good. Where will we go if we just on our hands and quit listening?
2. Tell them to stop making episodes. All right, really? With the OAC, different people raised different solutions and voiced their concerns over the many months prior to its release, but ultimately, not much was done. Writing some letters to Focus and demanding that they "stop making these episodes" is frankly childish and short-sighted. Also, it's not even the episode that's the problem right now. It's more the means of advertisement, as we've made clear.

In short, you admitted yourself to not caring. If anything, what you're doing comes off as very smug and condescending, taking time out of your busy schedule to aid the hopeless people who have no idea what to do. No. No. If you don't even care, then don't. You say that we "obviously hate stereotyping way too much," implying that you don't. Do you understand what a stereotype even is and what it does? Do you understand the damage that these stereotypes have had over the years? You don't seem to know or bother. If you wish to remain willfully ignorant, do so. But do not pass judgment in such a willy-nilly fashion and come off like a high-minded, condescending individual. Your attitude is detrimental >.>

1st of all: let me be the first gentleman and apologize for my actions. I'm sorry for hurting you and possibly your feelings. That was not my intention. Please forgive me.

Segue

My bad. I should've said something a tad differently. I don't care about the stereotyping because it doesn't influence my thinking (at least, an AiO stereotype). But if it truly is affecting others negatively, then I believe I have a duty to want to stop that. "Having a heart to want to stop your complaining" is me helping you FIX YOUR GRIEVANCES. But hey, I can see that you got it ALL under control. right?

1. Hey, if your goal is to stop people being influenced by stereotype, don't have them listen to it in the first place. Seems pretty logical to me.
2. Uh, you seem to have misread me. I never said for AiO to stop making episodes. I said for them to stop making episodes like this.

I never implied that I don't hate stereotyping. I implied that you hate it a lot more than I do. So you don't like the way they advertise? BECOME THEIR MARKETING REP then. *whispers* and actually, if anything, you're the one that's condescending because of the way you implied and said that I don't know what a stereotype is and its effects. Stooping that low? who's the childish one now? ;)

Let me tell you what I see in your first post: Personal anecdote that refutes the issue at hand, complaining about the issue at hand, and reminiscing about the "good 'ol days". Nothing in there tells me that you have done squat about it. If you don't want people to be smug or condescending, I would suggest, never start a topic like that again. Ever.

Nope, I'm not really smug and condescending. Let me break this down: You don't like the way AiO is advertising and you think it's slightly very offensive. Have you even told them how you feel? It would not surprise me if you haven't. If you haven't even told them, how do you expect something to be done about it? (that's shortsighted and childish right there.) If so, good for you! Move on to the next step. News flash though: YOU get to determine what needs to be done next. If you think posting on the ToO will somehow get Nathan Hoobler to realize that they're doing a poop job, you're shortsighted and childish. Déjà vu, but write a letter to AiO that tells them what your objections are and ask them to change. If you think that won't work so you won't even try, well what are you going to do then? Gotta try something, y'know? Otherwise, stop whining because as we all know, whining "is detrimental" to the rest of society who isn't bothered.

and if i didn't care, why would i still keep posting to encourage you to tell AiO about this.

Riddle me that, Batman.

*crosses fingers, posts, and hopes for the best.

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Posted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 5:41 pm 
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Whitty Whit wrote:
Nope, I'm not really smug and condescending. Let me break this down: You don't like the way AiO is advertising and you think it's slightly very offensive. Have you even told them how you feel? It would not surprise me if you haven't. If you haven't even told them, how do you expect something to be done about it? (that's shortsighted and childish right there.) If so, good for you! Move on to the next step. News flash though: YOU get to determine what needs to be done next. If you think posting on the ToO will somehow get Nathan Hoobler to realize that they're doing a poop job, you're shortsighted and childish. Déjà vu, but write a letter to AiO that tells them what your objections are and ask them to change. If you think that won't work so you won't even try, well what are you going to do then? Gotta try something, y'know? Otherwise, stop whining because as we all know, whining "is detrimental" to the rest of society who isn't bothered.

This paragraph is practically the definition of smug and condescending.

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 5:56 am 
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^this.

Jerms, I'm not going to write up another response, because we won't get anywhere. I was going to, but I decided againt it. However, I will say this: please, take a look at your attitude. You're not helping yourself, and you're not helping anyone here. It's your choice, though, and it's up to you to decide how you want to act. I'm not going to do that for you. If you have a problem with me, then so be it. Just save it for somewhere else. And also, you say that the "rest of society isn't bothered." You were the first person to show up who didn't even really care.

That's it.

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 12:14 pm 
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Bravo Marvin! Whitty do you realize that you are being condescending to missionaries. Feel free to take mission trip any day.

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 12:48 pm 
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Jelly wrote:
This paragraph is practically the definition of smug and condescending.


Oh. I guess that's how I always am then. :(

Marvin D. wrote:
Jerms, I'm not going to write up another response, because we won't get anywhere. I was going to, but I decided againt it. However, I will say this: please, take a look at your attitude. You're not helping yourself, and you're not helping anyone here. It's your choice, though, and it's up to you to decide how you want to act. I'm not going to do that for you. If you have a problem with me, then so be it. Just save it for somewhere else. And also, you say that the "rest of society isn't bothered." You were the first person to show up who didn't even really care.

That's it.


"You're not helping yourself,..." I wasn't even aware that was a goal.

I'm trying to help you realize that just complaining about the problem doesn't do anything. I've said that (in many ways) multiple times and yet you still haven't said if you've done anything. All you've done is (tried to) belittle me and my efforts. So be it. My takeaway (or what I've learned from this episode): You like to complain about things and argue with people but have little initiative to think up a solution. I see that a lot (and not only from you) and I don't think that's helpful to you or anybody else for that matter. If that's what you want me to think of you... So be it. I'm not goading another fight; I'm saying that, so far, I haven't seen any qualities (or any other qualities) about this thread other than it's just a place to bemoan certain life problems and enough apathy to asphyxiate a rather large horse.

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam. a metaphor that means my speech is done.

Blitz wrote:
Bravo Marvin! Whitty do you realize that you are being condescending to missionaries. Feel free to take mission trip any day.


I won't be condescending or smug by pointing out your bad grammar in a simple 3 sentences. I'm sure I've had some grammar mistakes in this thread, but I've also written a lot more content. But this is assuming that you have a basic knowledge of English grammar, which I am assuming. But now that I've pointed this fact out in a size 85 font, one could argue that I am being smug and condescending. I'm just choosing to be the better man and forgo the formality of actually telling you and generally being nice by not even bothering to correct it. Chew on that for a while. hehe. ;)

I take the word "missionaries" to mean missionaries as a whole rather than you and your family. If this is being condescending, then I've been condescending to a lot of different types of people. Guilty as charged, yes sir. I actually have gone on multiple a mission trip and have benefited from them immensely. I'm already planning to go on another one.

edit: fixed coding, switched some words around.
edit 2: reworded last paragraph.

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Last edited by Whitty Whit on Thu Feb 13, 2014 1:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post Post subject: Re: African Natives and Spears and Conflict, Oh My!
Posted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:41 pm 
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Whitty Whit wrote:
I'm saying that, so far, I haven't seen any qualities (or any other qualities) about this thread other than it's just a place to bemoan certain life problems and enough apathy to asphyxiate a rather large horse.

I have no idea what this means, but it's my new favourite thing in this thread.

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