Arrow

[bookworm]

Unthinkable:


Good, the cure works. Now they just have to figure out how to get it into everybody.

Ha, told you. Merlin's just fine. I wonder what's going to happen with him.

Is it really wise to lie to Roy about what happened? I mean, I get that he wasn't himself so in a way it may be better to not let him know he went crazy and killed a ton of people, but on the other hand what if he finds out somehow anyway.

Apparently where Sarah went off to earlier was to bring in the League of Assassins. That's... interesting. Not really sure how reasonable a development this is. As I remember the feeling that situation left off with was that they better never see each other again. But even if they had been on friendly terms, why would they get involved with this mess? They wouldn't. It has nothing to do with them.
(A minute later:)
What? They're doing this because Sarah agreed to go back to them if they helped? Uh, no... That's not at all an acceptable story idea, the writers are losing it or something. This makes all that major drama before completely meaningless. Sarah's whole family almost got killed for nothing?

Wait now, Roy is back to normal, but still wants out of the group? He wants to take Thea and leave?

That's why Oliver thought Sarah died? She was sucked into the water? The exact same thing that happened the first time he thought she died that she lived through? That's pretty disappointing after all the speculation, surely they could have come up with something better.

Excellent fake out of Slade; well done.

Very cool how they paralleled the fight here that finally ended all this with the one that stated it all back on the boat.

And there it finally is. Stuck him with the arrow instead of the needle and then the boat blows up. Unlike Sarah, that is a reasonable assumption of death.
Although now that I think of it, last time he shot someone in the eye and they appeared to be dead they didn't really die either. (Deadshot) It was even the same eye. That's interesting.

So Sarah is really going. I don't mind her leaving; it can't always be 'Arrow and Canary' she does need to go at least for a while for the show to keep developing. The problem is why she's going. Again, returning to the Assassins makes no sense and is completely unreasonable. There must have been another way to give her a reason to leave for a bit.

This better not be serious with Lance; the show can't lose him. This is just something to end the season with some concern that will be fixed soon into the next one I hope.

Oh what? Right after Thea and Roy finally have their happy reunion she leaves because, I don't even know why, she finds out he was working with The Arrow or something? She already knew that, first of all, and he said he was done with it anyway! What's her deal? And not just leaving, but leaving with Merlin. Wow, what is going to come of this?

So Slade is back on the island. That's some justice. It really actually makes me sad though; as I said a while back, all this shouldn't have gone the way it did. Oliver and Slade had a special relationship, it's terrible that it turned into this irreparable situation all because of something that initially was no one's fault at all. The whole thing is a real bummer.

What in the world? Oliver met Waller back then? And off the island? I'm very interested to see what next season's flashback story is about. It appears to be set in Hong Kong, but it can't stay there because we know whatever happened in the remaining three years he ends up back on the island because he was rescued from there in the first episode. But I don't see how he could get stranded back there now that he's off.

And that's it. Not sure where the show is going from here, a lot of major changes came at the end. They seem to be trying to get rid of as many characters as they can, which doesn't sit well. Moira gone forever, Thea gone allegedly forever, Sarah gone indefinitely, Roy possibly gone if he remains resolved to leave, and now Lance possibly gone pending the seriousness of his injuries.

I really wonder what the next season is going to be about. Just Oliver and the gang regrouping after all this? What changes or developments might be coming? Laurel is going to join the group now, for sure. I don't know if she'll actually go out on missions with Oliver but she can at least help behind the scenes. I would like Roy to return now that he's himself and Oliver's training can actually turn him into a good ally, but he said he still wanted out so I don't know. He was willing to go on one last run with the gang, so he's not completely against them, I think it was mostly because Thea was more important to him. Now that she's gone, maybe he'll rejoin for good. Or maybe he'll try to go after her.

[BlessedCheesemaker]

Thea isn't gone, she's just in a separate storyline for now. Barrowman has been cast as a season 3 regular, so I expect we'll be seeing her training by him and they will end up back in Starling City sooner rather than later.

I'm pretty sure that the "legs" that we speculated about (in season 1?) will turn out to be Waller who was managing everything that happened on the island.

Oliver's return to the island may have been self imposed in some way like we saw at the beginning of season 2.

[bookworm]

Thea isn't gone, she's just in a separate storyline for now.

I know that because this is a tv show, she will still be a character; but purely within the story at the moment she is gone. Her current intent is to leave the city and never return. It won’t work out like that, but that’s what the current situation is.

[The Top Crusader]

I have heard that this show starts kind of slow, but then more than makes up for it. CONFIRM OR DENY!!!???

[bookworm]

You would have to define slow, because I have heard that as well but did not personally think so at all when I started watching, I was enthralled immediately. I think what they mean is that it takes a lot of time setting up the character instead of jumping right into vigilante action. That is true, but that is necessary. It’s the point of the show. This isn’t just another superhero show where you watch the guy take on baddies left and right, this isn’t about the action, it’s about the character. The point of this show is what it’s like to actually live this double life. Everyone knows what the hero is like, but what is the story of the secret identity. So yes, in the beginning it takes its time to really establish who Oliver is and what has led him to this point, but that’s so you are invested in him as a person when he goes into action.

[Whitty Whit]

It starts out slow because it has a lot of backstory into the finale moments in the last, say, 4 or 5 episodes of the season. It is an amazing and worthwhile show though.

[Shennifer]

I'm only on season 2. I just watched the one where we first meet Barry Allen (who I know becomes The Flash, which is exciting)

I love it, especially this season, so far

[bookworm]

The Calm:

Red Arrow is finally here; it took long enough. Though I'm somewhat confused why Roy is suddenly back to being a fully active member of the group, I thought last we knew he was still down on them because of the Thea thing. I guess with her leaving he thought he might as well go back or something like that.

Woah, new logo.

Thea is keeping in touch? Why would she do that? They definitely gave the impression that she wasn't just leaving to put space between them, she was leaving to leave, cut ties. Strange.

Oh yeah, Oliver still doesn't have his company back. Darn.

Alright, let's see what these new flashbacks are about. Off the island.

Thank goodness Lance is okay. And it's awesome the police are now finally okay with The Arrow.

For real? Vertigo again? I don't know about this. Can they put enough spin on it to make it worthwhile, or is it just a filler plot they keep falling back on when they need a side problem for an episode?

It's Superman!

So Lance can't go in the field anymore, that's a real bummer. The show was just getting where I've wanted it to since the start, him and The Arrow taking guys down together. At least Oliver has full police cooperation now, that should stay in place even if Lance isn't there in person.

Aw, Superman is a bad guy. Or at least not a friendly. Hopefully he's not going to turn out to be another Isabel who wants to take over the company because he wants to get Oliver, hopefully he's just an objective business adversary who wants the company just because he wants it, nothing personal.

No no, Canary left just last episode, there's no way she could, much less should, be back already. What is this?
(A minute later:)
Come on. “I was on my way to see Laurel”? “We'll see” if this return is permanent? Did I miss something here? She didn't go on a vacation last episode, she went back to the League of Assassins. As in returned as a member. It took her killing herself for them to let her go the first time, it took her promising to return to keep them from killing her last finale, they would not let her come and go as she pleases now. What are the writers even thinking here, this makes no sense at all!

This isn't the end of Diggle, is it? Fine he doesn't go out on missions anymore, but he's still on the team, right? He can help from HQ. I get that his role needed scaled back, from a tv show perspective, now that Roy is in the field, but is doesn't need completely eliminated, from a story perspective. He's a vital part of the team.

Now that is a cliffhanger!

I mean, what? Bring back Sara just to get rid of her for good?

I am surprisingly okay with this idea. They needed to bring her story to a definite conclusion, and just having her ‘gone’ wasn't good enough, she could just randomly pop back up as we saw here. The show had it's time with Arrow and Canary, now he has a new partner. Keeping her around would clutter things. So I agree with the idea. Not so big on how they decided to do it.
As I said at the finale, her going back to the League did not work at all, storywise, and it's just more puzzling now with this development. Why would they force in an implausible way to send her off there, only to just as implausibly bring her back the very next episode to kill her off. She should have just stayed in town, the end result would have been the same, minus the glaring problems surrounding the return. Both returns, the return to the League and then the return from the League; neither one made any sense.

[Shennifer]

I'm finally all caught up.

I guess you're right about Thea keeping in touch being a little strange if she wanted to leave forever. But maybe she wanted them to know she was alive and just not around right now.

It's sad to see Sarah go, but I get how this will propel Laurel forward to become the next Canary (presumably)

I was bummed when Oliver and Felicity didn't decide to stay together after one date, but I'm glad she's wanting more out of life (hence working for Queen Consolidated)

Roy and Thea's reunion was nice; they seem to be on good terms again. Now that Oliver knows Malcolm is alive, I wonder when he'll find out about how Thea has been training with him.

[bookworm]

Sara:

Whaaat?? I never expected to see Tommy again. Though I don't know why, it's perfectly reasonable to put him in some flashbacks, I just never considered it I guess. But it's pretty crazy that he was in Hong Kong while Oliver was. Is there some actual purpose to that, or is it just forced coincidence to excuse having him back on the show I wonder.

Good, Diggle is still in on things.

Interesting, another bad archer but it's not Black Arrow.

Now, see, here's where they show's shoddy reasoning becomes a problem. Oliver says this wasn't the work of the League of Assassins because “they don't target their own” but as I pointed out last episode, Sara shouldn't be ‘their own’ anymore since she abandoned them once again to come back to the city. I know that in this new setting they were supposedly fine with that, but as I said it doesn't fit with the original situation. They wanted to kill her for leaving them the first time, she finally goes back to appease them but then immediately leaves again, then ends up dead in circumstances that would otherwise instantly point to the League. This should be a simple case of revenge, if the show had stuck to its original situation there. But the unexplained and nonsensical about face by the League concerning Sara makes everything wonky. I've accepted it for story purposes, so I trust Oliver that it's not the League, but in my mind I still can't reconcile the sudden change so the whole situation feels ‘off’ to me.

Oh I see, Tommy was there looking for Oliver because he was able to get into his email before. That's still pretty crazy, but it makes sense.

Woah, Roy never told Oliver that he knew why Thea left? That explains a lot.

I can't figure Superman out. Is he an actual invested bad guy here, or is he just a casual adversary?

Huh, this isn't the guy that got Sara? What are the odds that another archer assassin would be in town at the same time?

I assume Laurel never told Lance about Sara then? How long are they going to keep it from him? It's a strange reversal of the first secret, when Lance knew Sara was still alive but couldn't tell Laurel, now she knows she's dead but can't tell him.

Very clever way to wrap the Tommy problem up, well done.

Alright, time to see what Thea's been up to.

[Astronomer]

I must say, this season has been kind of boring for me. The first episode cliffhanger felt crammed in and I really didn't care about Sara dying. It was like "She's back!" and then "She's dead!" It felt too rushed for me to actually care about her dying. But maybe that's just because I'm heartless.
Episode two wasn't much better, though some of the backstory stuff was interesting.
Episode three got me a little more excited, with some stuff with Thea and some actual character stuff rather than just fights and explosions (though there were those also).
Episode four

was better. I'm actually starting to get back into caring about the show. I'm not sure if it was because of the offseason or because I really didn't care for a lot of the end of last season but I just don't care about the characters. This changed things. Things are getting set up, ideas are being planted, and Oliver is actually being nice! (Gasp!) There's going to be some interesting cross-overs with Flash, it will be cool to see how the two play out together.

[Shennifer]

Loved last week's ep about Felicity; it was really good

This week was great too. I found it a tad too coincidental that Laurel's trainer used to be a vigilante, but I get the parallel they were setting up and I liked how Oliver won't abandon Roy

Poor Roy thinks he killed Sarah and for a while Felicity and gang think so too. In the end, he didn't kill Sarah, but he did kill a cop. So that's still sad and all

[Termite]

I just started this today (and am six episodes in already) so I've skimmed past all your posts... and I have just one thing to say:

ABS.

[Shennifer]

I admit it; I ship Ray and Felicity
I do feel sorry for Oliver though

Felicity had heard that he felt he had to be alone though

Roy and Oliver going to Diggle's at the end

Cupid is delightfully insane

Apparently Ray is going to be another superhero/villain I guess

Termite: yes, the abs are lovely

[bookworm]

Corto Maltese:

So I forget, and don't know if I ever knew for sure in the first place, does Thea know Oliver is the Arrow? I know she'd been piecing things together about him and Roy.

And Oliver isn't aware Merlin is still alive, right? This will be interesting.

Argus really just happens to have someone that needs checked on in the same place Thea happens to be? I don't know, seems like a way to force extra content into the episode to me.

"I need you to help me find someone by Googling his phone or something." Best line ever.

Well that reunion went way better than I expected it to. And she even agreed to come back home, that really surprised me.

Laurel is going to take up Black Canary's mantle? I don't know about this. I should have seen it coming really, but I just don't know if it's a good idea for the show to go that route. We'll see what it's like.

[Shennifer]

Mid-season finale:

Laurel finally letting one of her parents know that Sara is dead

Oliver finding out more of how Thea has been hanging out with Malcolm

That fight between Thea and The Arrow was great; I've been anticipating that

Apparently, Malcolm drugged Thea which made her susceptable to suggestion, and he is responsible for Thea killing Sara. Didn't expect that
Oliver not turning Thea in, and deciding to take her place

Oliver and Felicity's moment at the end; and he told her he loved her! MY FEELINGS.

Oliver is dead. Or he's on the verge, or he'll come back to life somehow. I heard rumblings about something called the Lazarus Pit coming into play

[bookworm]

The Magician:

Hold on, Sara "came here for the League" now did she? That's not how she made it sound, thus my previously stated problems with it. If this was always the case and Sara's vagueness just misrepresented it that's much better.

Well that's an interesting way for Oliver to finally learn about Merlin, the League is after him?

Wow, Oliver isn't going to find out about Merlin and Thea? That is quite a shoe on the other foot, isn't it. After how upset she got about people keeping things from her, who's keeping the secrets now?

"My father may be The Demon, but yours is the Devil." That is a great one-liner.

No way, Waller was controlling Fyers? And it was about the Triad lady? That's either mindblowing interconnection or eyerolling coincidence, I can't tell which.

This Lance thing is tough. On one hand I understand why they haven't told him, and I think I even agree with that, but you have to think about the future. He's going to learn the truth eventually, and when he does how much do you tell him? The whole thing, so he finds out you'd kept it from him for however long? He'd probably understand why, but it would still be really hard on him. If they're going to tell him I think it needs to be soon, while the lapsed time is short enough for the wait to be reasonable.

Ra's al Ghul was recast? That's disappointing; I had read Liam Neeson was reprising the role from Batman Begins.

[The Top Crusader]

Liam Neeson wanted to do it but they didn't ask him.

Finally watched the first two episodes. I'm not like madly in love with the show just yet but it's good enough that I'm going to keep watching.

Speedy was always just some random guy, not his sister, though. >_>

[bookworm]

Other sources say they did ask, but it didn't work out with his schedule. Either way it's a shame.


Glad you're staying with it, I really think it will grow on you. I personally was hooked immediately, but I've heard a lot of other people say it took them a while. I haven't heard anyone say they've regretted hanging with it until it won them over though.

To your spoiler, just keep watching. Though it takes quite some time to get around to that.

-- 06 Jan 2015 02:02 pm --

The Secret Origin of Felicity Smoak:

That opening sequence was great.

Woah, Felicity backstory out of nowhere. This was unexpected.

I liked this episode quite a bit, it was a nice change of pace. I would have liked it even more if it had been even more of one though. There was potential for a fresh kind of action with having this new kind of villain, I would have really liked to see more of the dynamic between the group and the Eye. Them having to deal with the situations he's causing while trying to track him down. Like the thing at the bank, more of those kinds of incidents. Instead though there was minimal time spent on actual interaction with what was going on because the focus was primarily on backstory. Which wasn't a bad thing, I get why it was like that; that was what they wanted to get through from all this. It would have been fun to get more of the trying to combat an enemy they know nothing about though. Starting out having to be strictly reactive, responding to the various incidents he set off, but gradually forming a plan of how to deal with him and then finally getting ahead of him and having the confrontation. So really, the same general arc the episode did have, just drawn out a bit more than it was here. There just wasn't time to do that and have all the Felicity revelations though, so they had to cut back on the plot substance to fit in the character substance.

Cliffhanger... almost fail? It's extremely unlikely Roy is the one who killed Sara, so for creating drama it fails, but it does create intrigue to make you want to find out why he would think he did. So I guess it's alright.

[BlessedCheesemaker]

I'm back.

I don't remember where I was in reviews, so I'll just comment on yours so you can post the next one.

I enjoyed this episode, learning a little more about Felicity's history and why she is so good at everything she does. Kind of interesting for a character that was supposed to just be a random computer nerd in the first season.

Yeah, I thought the cliffhanger wasn't that great either. I was sure that Roy hadn't done it, but Paz thought he had, so I guess it worked for some viewers.